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39 minutes ago, lunababymoonchild said:

 

I fully understand why nobody would want to do the admin of this, or any other, site. And I thought that because the bills were being paid that we were alright. It's far too late to do anything about it now but I wonder why it wasn't put to the membership, long before it came to this, that a new Admin would be required and/or more moderators to step in to save the site from just dying? If nobody came forward then we would have known that the site was dying and that was that.

 

I don't know the answer to that but, as I remember that time, there was something of "Keeping BGO Going" at play.

Remember this was only 6 months or so after David had brought us through the last dreadful closure by 'vBulletin', and moved us to 'invision' with all the changes that entailed. It was an incredible amount of work, and we had been fortunate that David's circumstances allowed him to devote a lot of his energy on rescuing BGO.  We'd lost a lot of long-standing members after that last crash, and hadn't got properly back on our feet, so just wanted to avoid any other major changes.

 

There was some discussion of an addition to the moderating team after Grammath had moved on but there didn't seem, at that time, to be any obvious candidate.

 And nobody among the members, while sometimes commenting on the dwindling numbers of posts, made any suggestions for new initiatives to attract new members or encourage visitors to remain.

 

I just hung on here out of habit and a misplaced loyalty to Bill, to David, and to those members who were still posting. Clearly a not a sentiment shared by the members or mods who left - although i doubt if anyone actually, deliberately, 'left' -  just gradually stopped calling in.

It took too long for the mods to admit to themselves and each other that they felt that way.

 

We did discuss possible transfer of responsibility, but decided to see if anyone would be interested enough to suggest that as a possibility when Hazel started the Future of BGO thread. No-one made that suggestion or showed themselves eager to take the reins.

 

I believe the data is being archived, so BGO might be available for resurrection at some point.

No idea how that could be achieved.

 

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2 hours ago, megustaleer said:

We did discuss possible transfer of responsibility, but decided to see if anyone would be interested enough to suggest that as a possibility when Hazel started the Future of BGO thread. No-one made that suggestion or showed themselves eager to take the reins.


Announced to the three remaining members who, even if they wanted to, had no way of rectifying the situation. And it was presented as a fait accompli not an enquiry to see if anyone would take over. Frankly, at the time, the shock nearly did me in. I meant broach the subject much earlier than that. 
 

 I thank you for bothering, it's not you're fault and you have stayed until the bitter end. Maybe the others don't want to deal with questions that they can't answer.  I appreciate your presence and the fact that you do care enough to stay here so thank you for that.

 

 

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32 minutes ago, lunababymoonchild said:

 I appreciate your presence and the fact that you do care enough to stay here so thank you for that.

 

 

Meg: I echo Luna's sentiments. I also share her disappointment and her resentment.

 

Common courtesy is not often a feature of on-line relationships, alas. When I decided last year, to stop posting completely, I mentioned the fact on the Poetic Wanderings thread, and you wondered if it was anything you had done... I gave a brief explanation to Nick/MisterHobgoblin in a Facebook message, assuming he would pass it on to other moderators. But he too has disappeared from BGO.

 

A few months ago I returned to the Poetic Wanderings thread, having found I missed it.

 

In January 2014 I posted a heartfelt eulogy to David. Nick/MHG had pointed out that "David was BGO", and I think that was, perhaps still is, the case.

 

Meg, as you have said, online exchanges are a curious kind of social life. I am old enough to remember pre-Internet, pre-email times, when people phoned each other, and even wrote letters. On paper, in envelopes.

 

I vaguely remember that, in my early days, I sent small financial contributions to BGO. In the same way that I contribute regularly to wikipedia. But so many people take so many things for granted, even if, to recycle an old saying, there's no such thing as a free lunch.

 

Writing this saddens me.

 

Best wishes to all reading this, however few you may now be.

 

John

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2 hours ago, lunababymoonchild said:


Announced to the three remaining members who, even if they wanted to, had no way of rectifying the situation. And it was presented as a fait accompli not an enquiry to see if anyone would take over. Frankly, at the time, the shock nearly did me in. I meant broach the subject much earlier than that. 
 

 I thank you for bothering, it's not you're fault and you have stayed until the bitter end. Maybe the others don't want to deal with questions that they can't answer.  I appreciate your presence and the fact that you do care enough to stay here so thank you for that.

 

 

I too thought the way it was presented to us it was a fait accompli. I do believe at least one member did ask about being able to keep the site going. I also would like to thank Meg for staying with us till the end. 

 

I will definitely miss this site. I can understand people's lives changing and Moderators and Admin no longer wishing to commit time to the upkeep. I was never approached and of course I never offered. I find little time to offer to such a commitment. But perhaps it would have been good to have the discussion a year before the cut off date, let members make suggestions (perhaps tried to find funds to advertise the site or somehow raise our online profile, I don't know how those things work but it seems we were not given the opportunity to explore ways of keeping the site going) and if still no way of keeping the site going then at least we'd have known all had been tried. I'm not accusing any mods or admin, without their work in the past few years BGO wouldn't have got this far. Just bemused I suppose.

 

It's a cliche but we do live in changing times and BGO seemed a constant, a place like an old library, where one could wander in from the cold and peruse the covers and choosing one settle down at a seat or table and loose track of time. Smile and nod to the regulars, check the noticeboard, read a 'newspaper' and basically feel at home. 

 

I feel sad that all that will come to an end, and of course most things do, we move on, we turn corners, start again. I just don't know if I want to start again. I have too many books to read and most likely not enough years of life left to read them all so why do I need new suggestions? Because of course it wasn't just about the reviews, it was the connection, the knowing that someone else understood that moment of starting a book. Of being drawn in, losing time and reality as another world enveloped us. That moment at the end of a great story where you have a mixture of satisfaction and a desire for more. Of characters and places that stay with us all our lives, that changed us, changed how we thought, how we viewed the world and our fellow humans.

 

In three weeks that connection will be lost. And luckily for you all you won't have to read anymore of my ramblings. Thank you for your company, for the acknowledgements, the agreements and the disagreements. Thank you for being.  

 

 

  

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OK, I'm putting this out there...


It might be possible that I could take on the site and keeop it running.  I think for that to happen we would need to have more posts (book reviews expecially) and we would need to attract new members otherwise the site will just wither and die.

 

So, I guess if enough of you want to, we can keep the site going.

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 Having looked back over the "decision making".

It was actually presented to the moderators as a decision more or less already made, and to those of us who ha become despondent at the diminished version of BGO we had become it came as a relief.

 

 One moderator  did show an interest in keeping going, and has very recently expresses that interest again.

 I don't know if anything will come of it, but  I would give what little support i can to any such project, so

keep that little flame of hope flickering!

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Ha,tag! I was trying to preserve your anonymity in my post above ;)

Not sure enough people are still visiting, but if you get a good response I will be behind you.

As I have already said, unfortunately that will not include book reviews, but I would continue to be a presence on as many forums as I can manage.

 

Maybe a new thread, eg  "Anyone Interested In a BGO  Rescue?" might catch the eye of any passing member

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Hi everyone, 

 

The day that the site fees are due is the 6th June. I have emailed Tag who has shown interest in running the site from then and will help with with all the accounts etc. 
 

I am sorry people feel that I fucked off and became an absentee landlord. You are all right in that, I did. When David died, I did reluctantly take over Admin duties because no one else wanted to battle with the accounts. I was already spending less time here. I went from a full time mother to a full time working mother so BGO became less of a priority. I changed up jobs two years ago and now I have a full time plus job. But I still paid the bills for BGO. the site dying is not my fault. Like you all, who have the choice when you spend time here, continue your active membership - I also have that choice. JFP, i bristle at your scorn - you stopped visiting here regularly a while ago too - shouldn’t I have that option too? As long as the bills got paid? Yes, I own that often I was delayed in replying or dealing with things, but I don’t owe anyone a laundry list of things in my life that take up my time. 
 

As for it being a fait accompli, well, yes, that is how it was presented purely because the facts of the site are so stark. I stood up and called it. I always said if someone wanted to take it over, then I would help them. But the reality is the reality we have. The online landscape is very different to what it was in 2004 and failure to recognise that won’t change BGO’s reality. 
 

That said, my heart has lifted a little at Tags proposal and if he decides to take over, then I will help him with all the accounts etc. I didn’t have any help when David died, I knew nothing about computers or how to run a site or deal with domain names, security patches, upgrades - I wouldn’t put Tag in the same position. 

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I can only say that, as a member, I had drifted away without really noticing, and as a mod, there wasn't much for me to do. Like Hazel, I had other responsibilities and demands on my time. It's an unfortunate aspect of online life that people can drift off and you never know why: I often think that, when David died, we were very lucky to actually find out.

I fully understood why the decision was taken to close the site if no-one was able to take it in, but if Tag can do it, it would be great.

One thought: on reflection, the fact that it's a web based forum probably puts me off visiting slightly, since most things I visit regularly are app based. If an update offered an app, it might be worth looking at, in case other potential users feel like I do. Of course I have no idea if such a thing is likely.

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6 minutes ago, Minxminnie said:

One thought: on reflection, the fact that it's a web based forum probably puts me off visiting slightly, since most things I visit regularly are app based. If an update offered an app, it might be worth looking at, in case other potential users feel like I do. Of course I have no idea if such a thing is likely.

That's a good point.  I often browse the site on my phone (albeit on a browser). The mobile version of Invision is pretty good.

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45 minutes ago, Hazel said:

Hi everyone, 
 

I am sorry people feel that I f***ed off and became an absentee landlord. You are all right in that, I did. When David died, I did reluctantly take over Admin duties because no one else wanted to battle with the accounts. I was already spending less time here. I went from a full time mother to a full time working mother so BGO became less of a priority. I changed up jobs two years ago and now I have a full time plus job. But I still paid the bills for BGO. the site dying is not my fault. Like you all, who have the choice when you spend time here, continue your active membership - I also have that choice. JFP, i bristle at your scorn - you stopped visiting here regularly a while ago too - shouldn’t I have that option too? As long as the bills got paid? Yes, I own that often I was delayed in replying or dealing with things, but I don’t owe anyone a laundry list of things in my life that take up my time. 
 

As for it being a fait accompli, well, yes, that is how it was presented purely because the facts of the site are so stark. I stood up and called it. I always said if someone wanted to take it over, then I would help them. But the reality is the reality we have. The online landscape is very different to what it was in 2004 and failure to recognise that won’t change BGO’s reality. 
 

That said, my heart has lifted a little at Tags proposal and if he decides to take over, then I will help him with all the accounts etc. I didn’t have any help when David died, I knew nothing about computers or how to run a site or deal with domain names, security patches, upgrades - I wouldn’t put Tag in the same position. 


I didn't put it like that and nor would I. I just thought that if it was getting too much for you - and why would it not? - you could have taken a second and let the general membership know when we had a fuller membership and maybe we could have sorted this out sooner, that's all. We were all reeling from David's death and nobody knew what to do. As I said previously, because the bills were being paid I thought that everything was alright. 
 

We are here now, lets see what we can accomplish together from now on.

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It being “too much” for me isn’t the issue. This came to a head because we were running out of money and dwindling posts and membership meant the site was slowly dying, I didn’t want to see it go out that way. Everyone noticed the issue of dwindling posts and new members. We have seen it for a long time. I kept paying the bills when we were able to keep paying them but eventually the money has to run out because of a dwindling membership and activity. I raised it with the mods when I knew it was going to be an issue. I have said frequently since David died that I would continue to be Admin until someone else wanted to take over, even though I wouldn’t be as active, I have never hidden that. 
 

Faced with the financial reality, I also proposed making the FB page more viable. I don’t want BGO to die - I would love it to stay in some form as much as anyone else. But I tried to be very realistic. Am trying to be realistic. 
 

But, you know, I’ll take the crap thrown at me. It certainly has been enlightening tonight. 

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5 minutes ago, Hazel said:

But, you know, I’ll take the crap thrown at me. It certainly has been enlightening tonight. 

I was one of the first to agree that the site was no longer viable.  And you Hazel, are not responsible for how things have changed over the last few years.

But I have had second thoughts...

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27 minutes ago, Hazel said:

But, you know, I’ll take the crap thrown at me. It certainly has been enlightening tonight. 


I wasn't throwing crap at you, I felt I was merely making an observation. If throwing crap is how you took it, then I'm sorry, that was not my intention at all. All of this has come as news to me and in a very short time, I'm shocked. Please excuse my inappropriate comments. 

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Can someone explain how the 'bill's are paid? It was made to sound like they get paid if there are more posts. How does that work? 

 

I only read and review a book once a month roughly but could certainly post more in other areas. 

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More members that are active on the site, use the Amazon banner to purchase, we get affiliate money. Not really post related, just more members, more people using the banner. 

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2 hours ago, Hazel said:

More members that are active on the site, use the Amazon banner to purchase, we get affiliate money. Not really post related, just more members, more people using the banner. 


How many are required, roughly, to make this viable?

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It is impossible to quantify that. Purchases, each different type of purchase, attracts a different percentage kicked back to BGO. But we need to make about £150 a year from the affiliate programme to keep the site running without having to ask the membership for money. It doesn’t sound like a lot, but right now, with the memberS we have that use the Amazon banners, we make about £70 a year. Those percentages, that Amazon give us, has decreased year on year as Amazon squeeze the kickback. 
 

To provide how many would be required, would require me to know how many people will use the banner and what they are going to buy, precisely. 

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3 minutes ago, Hazel said:

It is impossible to quantify that. Purchases, each different type of purchase, attracts a different percentage kicked back to BGO. But we need to make about £150 a year from the affiliate programme to keep the site running without having to ask the membership for money. It doesn’t sound like a lot, but right now, with the memberS we have that use the Amazon banners, we make about £70 a year. Those percentages, that Amazon give us, has decreased year on year as Amazon squeeze the kickback. 
 

To provide how many would be required, would require me to know how many people will use the banner and what they are going to buy, precisely. 

 

Thank you, that's all I wanted to know. 

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5 hours ago, Hazel said:

More members that are active on the site, use the Amazon banner to purchase, we get affiliate money. Not really post related, just more members, more people using the banner. 

 

See, I didn't know that.

 

Just bought four books from Amazon. Went straight to their site though. I will now endeavor to use the banner. 

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 The link on my computer that I use to access Amazon is copied from the banner at the top of the page here, so i don't even have to visit BGO to use it.  I am hoping that means that everything I buy from Amazon  puts a couple of pence into BGO's coffers.

 

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